Discussion:
One of the reasons making Laos undeveloped
(too old to reply)
blublu
2005-05-08 13:30:08 UTC
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Being Chinese students studying Lao language, we are always wondering
why this beautiful country is so poor, undeveleped--------maybe one
the 10 poorest countries in the World--released by the World Bank.
Parts of our students find one element, that is, the culture of Laos,
which regards being happy as the most important thing in their own
life, rather than the material progress, like the Chiness. That is why
almost all Chinese travelling or working in Laos have the strange
feeling that the Lao people are always "Lazy" .
But I think "LAZY" is not a stable word.
My dear friends, what's your opinion towards this element despite many
other reasons whatever historcial or geographical?
Joe Fukawe
2005-05-08 13:34:47 UTC
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No bro, it ain't lazy, it's the 'easy going' or
ບໍ່ເປັນຫຍັງ attitude but the main reason is the
communist one party system and of course 'corruption'
blublu
2005-05-08 13:43:05 UTC
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The word lazy I mentioned should be regarded as feelings of some of my
friends,
as to the main reason you mentioned, one example is my own country
China, although it is also run the commnist party and has its own
problems, but yes, Joe, it is growing rapidly. And I strongly agree
with you on the "corruption" issue, I have some sad and didgusting
expierences with them.
Padek
2005-05-08 15:09:21 UTC
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Blu. China better grow fast if not it would looks like a big dummy
country with all the people it has. And you don't want Japaneses to
say look at all the people it has, its still way far behind us.
Believed me Lao people will get material soon, just look at people in
big city like vientaine everyboby wants big house cars. Again, I 'm
glad that China progress quickly so that maybe some other poor
southeast Asia can learn from. And maybe become leader of Asia
country. Padek ee Le.
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-08 19:08:12 UTC
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atittudes? corruption plagues?

they are poor lao but they grow their own food, they lack education
because they could not fiance it. or for some circumstances had to
drop out (family)

china is getting richer but don't forget that theres 990 million poor
chinese in china. are they lazy? has your friends experiences all the
backward
setting of china? the dirt road the peasant life?

foreigns investment is the big drive particularly from chinese expats
there are 70 million chinese living outside china. They have all the
worlds know how from every corner of the globe. Nearly 45% investment
comes
from this group. This is one major factor to china success.

Lao has 700,000 expats we are only beginning to realise and have
tasted western educations. metamorphic stage. it about creating a
clear investment framework to attract potential expats and reducing the
level of corruption in Lao
blublu
2005-05-08 20:19:39 UTC
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zinss have you ever met or worked with the Lao officials?
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-09 06:23:29 UTC
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yao, wo bu hao
blublu
2005-05-09 12:00:01 UTC
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what do you mean zinss?
ລາວນອກ
2005-05-09 12:11:09 UTC
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Are you Chinese? LOL

Somxay
blublu
2005-05-09 12:20:00 UTC
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yep, but still puzzled, should it be translated as
要,我不好. or anything else?
很好奇啊,为什么有好多人会中文呢?
And it makes me curious that why so man
ລາວນອກ
2005-05-09 12:32:39 UTC
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We are all just trying to make you feel welcomed and at home in here.
We are showingsharing with you what little we know in Chinese. Surely
you are not expecting us to speak, read and write in Chinese
fluently?...although I think I should start learning (note to self ~
start learning Chinese).

Don't think anything of it youngman. We are only fascinated by you and
China in general and want more of it.

When you get a chance, please post some pictures of your exploits.

Thank you,
Somxay
blublu
2005-05-09 12:37:39 UTC
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Thank you Laonork~~~~ Thank you for all of you so much for saying so
and doing so. And I know Chinese is a language hard for the foreingers
to learn, but in fact it shares many common places with Laotian ,
especially the grammar, so there are many Lao students studying Chinese
or other majors in Bejing Shanghai or other cities of China.
I do not think I can post my photos here, can I ?
ລາວນອກ
2005-05-09 12:45:33 UTC
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No, but you can set up free webpages, post your pics than put links to
your page in here.
blublu
2005-05-09 13:00:16 UTC
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Ok, this week I have to prepare for my final test for graduation. Plz
wait.~~
ລາວນອກ
2005-05-09 13:05:08 UTC
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We'll do. Good luck on your exam!
n***@hotmail.com
2005-05-09 16:03:59 UTC
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Why not? you can post your photos here so we all can enjoy looking at
them.

noiy
ກາສາລາວ
2005-05-09 16:46:45 UTC
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早晨,

你今天怎么样? 做你活附近上海吗?

--casalao
Post by blublu
yep, but still puzzled, should it be translated as
要,我不好. or anything else?
很好奇啊,为什么有好多人会中文呢?
And it makes me curious that why so many people here can read or
ລາວນອກ
2005-05-09 19:13:27 UTC
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Good morning Ai CasaLao,

Who lives in Shanghai?

Somxay
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-09 12:14:14 UTC
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different atittudes
corrupt talk and corrupt action
not good any country or people.
useless to me
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-11 06:55:38 UTC
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chung man do you have a working email? I have a personal question
which
I think would be interesting to know.
blublu
2005-05-12 09:55:27 UTC
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are you asking me ?
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-12 10:47:24 UTC
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yao,
ລາວນອກ
2005-05-08 13:40:28 UTC
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With most of the world being developed, maybe being undeveloped is a
good thing.

The last Paradise. It is a secret. Don't tell the rest of the world.

Somxay
blublu
2005-05-08 13:44:00 UTC
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Huh huh~~~
drsouk
2005-05-08 14:02:04 UTC
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sabaidi blublu,
are the lao lazy? viet, french, thai and other say commonly that "lao are
lazy". if we take the case of french colonialist using lao to build roads
(without paid), it is easy to think that the lao were not lazy, just make
resistence against exploitation. most of the lao (peasans) work too much
just to have something to eat, if you are travelling throuth laos, you can
see it, if you want.
Post by blublu
Huh huh~~~
ລາວໃຫຍ່
2005-05-08 17:49:53 UTC
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blublu
2005-05-08 18:16:38 UTC
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drsouk I have travelled all of the provinces in Laos.
Joe Fukawe
2005-05-08 14:01:25 UTC
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blublu & Laonork,

China has always been the powerhouse, Chinese work ethics is second to
none and I just don't say that just to be on your good side, it's just
my observation.

Laos on the other hand, if you just look at its history, without WWII,
French against British colonial influences, Laos wouldn't be a country,
she would get assimilated into China, Burma, Thailand, Cambodia and
Vietnam. It's said that Lao political thoughts and minds fell from the
sky, Laos nationalism didn't really materialized until the Lao Issara
movement, even then, the French still had a tight hold on Laos. Laos
was recognized by others as an independent state within the French
Union? Unfortunately, Laos wasn't strong enough to hold her own when
the French got their butt whip at Dien Bien Phu. Had she been able to
stand on her own then, outside interferences/influences wouldn't play
such an important roles in her internal affairs 'til today.

So what do you think of the Vietnamese influences in Laos? Just
curious.

Laonork - in a way, I would agree with you but think about the
impoverish oppressive Lao citizen.


Joe
blublu
2005-05-08 14:14:01 UTC
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BRO. Joe, In terms of the Vietnamese influences, I am totally
puzzled by the common Lao people's attitude towards Vietnam. Before I
came to Laos, I thought Lao people hated to be along with the
Vietnamese and are forced to be brothers with that un-polite state and
they must have strong desire to show their friendship with the Thai
people, after all, they have so much in common. BUt after in Laos,
whenever I asked the Lao people about the Viet, they always told me
about their brother-like friendship, although I myself hate to talk
with the Vietnamese for they are always not knowing respect others----
I mean, the Vietnamesess in Laos all regard themselves as Higher Class
and looked down upon the Lao people, but the Lao people seem to be used
to this kind of strange
relationship.
As for the state-nation status of Laos in history, I think the
distinguished social culture, especially the Buddhits religiour belief
help Laos maintain its own charateristics across its history.
ລາວນອກ
2005-05-08 14:48:55 UTC
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If you want to see lack of respect and lack of common politeness, go to
any Chinatown and into a good tasting restaurant. Service sucks, they
slam the plate down when they serve you and they don't follow up on
your welfare, unlike most well heeled restaurants, but the food is
soooooo gooooood! I'm sure they don't mean any disrespect, no not
aware?

Joe: I like Laos the way it is...

Somxay
blublu
2005-05-08 15:09:13 UTC
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I agree with you, Laonaok, in this field, Chinese and Vietnamese are
much the same. They do not mean to be unpolite, but they have done so.
I think that is a result of lack of religions in both of the two
countries.
n***@hotmail.com
2005-05-08 20:27:22 UTC
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blublu:

Lazy? you can put it that way. As I understand it, one big problem with
Laos is that the Laotians have always lived in a mountainous,
landlocked, and underpopulated country by themselves. They have never
been forced into really do-or-die situations where they have to
struggle, compete, and overcome, to survive, like the Chinese or the
Viet, and others. In other words, they have not grown out of clones of
survivors, and their competing-related genes don't have to be highly
activated for them to survive. They grow their rice, fish in the river,
raise their chicken and buffaloes, and go to temples. And that's it.

As for the world bank records, I agree that Laos is among the world
poorest countries, and I am not proud of it, but I need to point out
that Laos is not among the 10 poorest. According to the Human
Develpment Index, Laos ranked 135 out of 175 countries. In Asia, in
term of GDP per capita, poor Laos is ahead of other poor countries like
Burma, Nepal, Bhutan, afganistan, and many of the African countries. I
am not trying to defend anybody, Laos has a long way to go, and a lot
of progress to make in all aspects. But I just want to tell you what I
have learned. Look at these sites:

http://hdr.undp.org/reports/global/2004/

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/la.html

http://www.unicef.org/infobycountry/index.html
blublu
2005-05-09 12:13:16 UTC
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Noi:
In fact there are always two definitely different opinions fighting
against each other in my mind. One opinion told me , Laos is poor, so
it needs reform, development or even revolution while another opinion
laughed: now that what you have seen ,my master, all the Lao people you
have chatted, lived with or have some coversations with in this holy
land are much happier than the Chinese people you know ( I do have this
kinda conclusion after one-year time in Laos), then why should you say
the Lao people should change? what's your definition of happiness or
success? Aren't you tired of the chaos of human being's ugly desire? In
fact , the men who should change are not the Lao people, but the
Chinese and American who care about the secular success too
much and have already forgotten the truth of the life.
So, as to the topic of this post, is only one aspect of arguing
question, not meaning anything else.
n***@hotmail.com
2005-05-09 15:58:21 UTC
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blublu:

I have this same mixed feeling inside myself about Laos.

On the one hand, as someone who had left Laos for years, and has had
since to struggle and overcome mental and physical challenges to be
what I am today in this society, it happens sometimes to me to express
my anger against my own relatives back in Laos when I contacted and
asked them how things have been going (and off course they were
surpirsed and wondered what happened to me). They seemed so easy and
happy going. Basically, for them, if you cannot finish the work today,
you will finish it tomorrow or even later. For me, that reaction
reflects such an inefficiency and un-competitiveness.

On the other hand, in this highly competitive society, I am happy when
I feel I have performed well and when my work is recognized by others.
But I am sometimes, and even more and more frequently, stressed and
worried about what will happen tomorrow if the others do better than us
and beat us, and if I lose my job and can no longer pay all those
bills. And then I have to look for ways to ease my stress, by thinking
about something else totally different and more peaceful and positive
that can tell me on my face "why the hec are you so stressed and
worried about, you idiot?". And I usually think about Laos and Laotian
people, and my happy days spent with them, my innocent days wandering
around the country.

Then again, I have to come back to earth to a society where I have to
remind myself that I have to reamin competitive, or else disappear.
ກາສາລາວ
2005-05-09 17:15:11 UTC
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blublu,

hmmm...are we, the LAO race, lazy or is there something else deeper in
us? maybe if i rephrase your question this way: are the laonay ready to
join the rat race for full-blown consumerism? the answer is NO for we
go by the BOH-PEN-NHANG mojo.

now if you are here with me in southern california and follow me for a
couple days, you will have a different opinion about this laonok guy by
the name of casalao. i pursue consumerism like everybody else. i
usually leave my BOH-PEN-NHANG baggage at home and work my ass off and
then go home and pop my BOH-PEN-NHANG bag out of the closet for a few
hours and knock myself out unconscious 'til the next day.

btw, my utmost admiration for you guys up north for having taken china
out of the darness and is poised to be come the next super power in the
next couple decades. that is no small feat. we have a lot to learn from
you.

so Lao PDR, send your kids to Shanghai and not Hanoi.

--casalao
blublu
2005-05-12 10:13:40 UTC
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The same feeling I got right now~~~~ Taking my Lao language exam~~So
hard~~
n***@hotmail.com
2005-05-12 14:30:43 UTC
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blublu:

Regarding your lao exam, what kind of exam is it? writing, vocal?
If I have to take a lao test right now, I will fail badly. The main
reason? not only I haven't written lao very much since the telephone
and eternet boom, but also I don't know how much of the current lao has
changed from the old lao that I learned decades ago!

Good luck with your lao exam. By the way, what can you do in China with
a lao language certificate?

noiy
ກາສາລາວ
2005-05-12 15:19:38 UTC
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noiy,

blublu is probably working on this thesis. china is poised to become a
superpower so it sends people to the far-flung corners of the world
learning all kinds of languages. there are chinese deep in the sands of
Sudan looking for oil and making friends.

the middle kingdom has come a long way when it started to play catchup
with the rest of the industrialized world. way to go, china.

Lao PDR, send your kids to china and not vietnam.

--casalao
Post by n***@hotmail.com
Regarding your lao exam, what kind of exam is it? writing, vocal?
blublu
2005-05-14 06:49:03 UTC
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Hi , I finally have finished the exam. Noi, in fact I am taking the Lao
literature major in the bachelor degree of Beijing Foreign Studies
University, and this is my last year and also the fourth year of study.
And this exam is the last exam in my university life~so happy~~
and what we will exam must be various~~~ The lao history, the Lao
geography, the listening skills, the spoken skills, and what's more,
translation laotian into Chinese and Chinese into Laotian in oral and
in writing.
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-14 09:19:05 UTC
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hen hao blu,

I still would be grateful if you could give me your email as I too am
writing a
global commerce, influence and power. i have read chinese and europe,
le shi ,now I am drafting a current setting of world affairs.
ລາວນອກ
2005-05-14 09:34:13 UTC
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zinss,

That sounds kewl... Where are you studying?

Si Hahet
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-15 07:54:22 UTC
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I completed my academic education 4 years ago from uk and passed with
flying color

It is very interesting to observe 'the current counter economic
manuevre being forged. rich countries consider this a growing but
evitable event which will lead to a disperse of current trade monopoly
longed enjoyed by the them.'

it topic like above allows to me see a world from an economic
perspective
and how it may shape in two decades.
blublu
2005-05-15 12:33:04 UTC
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zinss, you can write me to this email: ***@gmail.com
with pleasure to do something for you ~~~
blublu
2005-05-15 12:45:20 UTC
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or ***@sohu.com
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-15 15:13:40 UTC
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the gmail does not work. I will try this sohu.com
xie xie chung man
blublu
2005-05-16 10:21:16 UTC
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oh zinss, infact, I think the google group sysytem does not let us to
show our email address...
blublu
2005-05-16 12:24:16 UTC
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my @sohu.com address is zyzy624 and then plus the @sohu.com. lol~~
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-16 17:32:19 UTC
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for a moment ,I though china was blocking my mail.

xie xie, I will email in a few days
Vanh
2005-05-09 23:21:57 UTC
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Lao's underdevelopment tend to be often oversimplified by many even in
this forum or as a simple trend of laziness. Well if laziness is the
only cause, nothing should be of great concern, because laziness can be
just temporary exertion and curable by the right environment of social
competitiveness as for any individual once this one has to struggle for
his/her own survival, people become less lazy. Unfortunatly whoever is
drawing this kind of easy conclusion is undermining the whole complex
issues of Lao's geographical, historical, social, economical, and
internal conflicts problems, which have deeply impacted the human
behavior of the whole Lao society ever since the founding of the
country up to today.

Many informations could be found from a collection of resarch books
from the Westerners and Asians alike on this subject. However, I'm
simply glad to reintroduce a few of these basic characters often made
up of the misundestanding from which it seems to obstruct the human
core condition from the real development of Laos in the modern times.

First thing comes in mind, is Lao's vast under populated density which
has ever been threated by the struggle of survival from starvation or
famine. So the country has been blessed for generations of easy way of
life, as result, naturally developed with a sense of inrush and less to
compete for non-essential things, because the harsch human condition is
not required to do so like those overpopulated countries such as in
Vietnam or China where struggle is a way of life, and resist to work
could spell simply death.

Historically, the population has never been properly united under one
central governance's allegiance not until last century under the French
colonial times to form one rule to pledge for a resemblance of one
country status. This tends to delay the natural process of the sense of
statehood belonging, where many still believe they still pledge to
their own Bane and Muang, and the word Pathet is not the familiar term
used by many even today. Muang Lao rather than Pathet Lao is still
buried deeply in the psychological sense of belonging.

Social bonding is particularly strong based on the buddhist traditons
or animistic worship essentially around the the vicinity of buddhist
temples or village, or township level without any strong building block
of middle commerce or trading among people, but only basic bartering
at the local. This vacuum in competitive trading classes since
centuries has tended to create a society less competitive and short in
enterpreneurship which are the ingredients of any basic economy or
human developments into supplies and demands.

Internal conflicts have been one of the most devastating factor to
establish any durable legacy of governance on which people can depend.
Up to now, the Lao government still with dictatorial stance has just
begun to learn the ABC of economy and governing basic skills. It's fair
to say that any government even priro to the communist regime has never
established any roll model from which Lao people can learn and take
pride, because in any country, people need a favorable environment
created by the government like in China actually especially for
encouraging and promulgating the law of free exchange in goods and
service of economy even with less degree of freedom people can tolerate
or accept for the time being, but essentially at least it's a guidance
of direction people need to orient themselves without fear of reprisal.
Of course, in Lao DRP, we can't expect the same miracle like in China
at least yet, because unfortunaly we have been stuck in such dilemma of
two folds at once, government lacks of inspiration and people lacks of
skills. So these gravities pulls in different directions, any
foreseeable progress has to depend absolutely on the huge quantity of
graduates from a steady functional of education system from K1 to
College and beyond.Of course, 30 years have gone by could have formed
enough any of competent class to tackle the economy or else problems...
Time has stuck again in another yet immobility of Lao habit with no
avail of any miracle. Nobody expects any easy answer, but at least
expect some established structure to pave the way of accommodation for
the future.

Up to now, how anyone can perceive any tangible progress since the
funding of schools is still way down just secondary to the funding of
the high ranking official's own villa or housing. The disparity doesn't
give any precise goal for education as the most vital priority for the
country.

Here we go, it's more than any simple laziness as anyone wants to
characterize for Lao's underdevelopment. It really needs a
revolutionary and fundamental face lift in doing things other than the
usual "Bo phene Ngang".


Vanh
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-10 06:16:28 UTC
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89% of raw sewage is released everyday into the rivers of china(plus
countless chemicals).

All it's cities are the most polluted

it 's wild siberian tiger is extinct. there only a small zoo
population. It only has 12 river dophins left.

it health and safety issues is poor. hundred of people die in illegal
coal mines every month.


Lao lack of exposure.

western ideas has rubbed on us, that how ,vanh we have a very different
atittudes. western ideas will rub on Lao eventually then it's
traditional way of existnce would be sacrificed?

there are 990 million poor chinese where Lao has 4.6 million. Lao can
solve this within 15 years?
Vanh
2005-05-15 16:09:12 UTC
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written by Zinss
Lao lack of exposure.
western ideas has rubbed on us, that how ,vanh we have a very
different
atittudes. western ideas will rub on Lao eventually then it's
traditional way of existnce would be sacrificed?
there are 990 million poor chinese where Lao has 4.6 million. Lao can
solve this within 15 years?
Zinss,

In a way, we all paraphrase ourselves back and fro with the same good
ideas like what you had expressed above. I agree with those two key
words like "Exposure" and "Attitude", however, as I stated before, in
order for "Western exposure" and "Attitude" to be transformed into a
Lao national practical and conscious character in all walks of life;
the country really needs to reinvent itself with a new fundamental
thinking from the top leadership who has endured up to now to be a part
of problem, rather a good examplar of solution . The decision making
process has been somewhat dampened by lack of vision, and as often
characterized as at the snail's pace for change .

The leadership quality can be compared to a great captain of a ship,
holds the faculty of knowing how to steer the ship for the safety for
all passengers in times of any stormy weather, because the fate of all
those passengers depend on himself how to proceed his decision alone.
We can dig in any other country's historic experience to reflect on our
own to see, if is not due to the good visionary leadership, none of
countries can be shifted from a stagnant immobility to moving
prosperity.

Again, what has made China so typically successful today precisely is
her leadership who dares to challenge the open door policy beyond her
own historical distrust of foreigners. But now her economy is even more
opened than Japanese one in bureaucratic entanglement.

Think again, we tend to blame the passengers rather than the captain of
the ship, who has the steering wheel in his hands? Not the passengers!
Our Lao's historic immobility as often characterized as "Laziness" can
be cured and is curable, but only but the leadership has to possess
that kind of inspirational guidance and provide the vision and tools of
change, otherwise we will talk about the same damned problmes in the
next 15 years again and again. Don't blame the passengers for the
shipwreck or sinking of the ship!



Vanh
z***@hotmail.com
2005-05-16 07:29:39 UTC
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what laos need is new educated blood, I agree on visionary like dr
mahathir of malaysia.
There are always hard working and lazy people in every country. I
don't blame the people. but I am annoyed
when working with lazy individual. nothing gets done and waste of time

idle hands makes a person lazy.
busy hands makes a person rich.

each individual is the architect of their destiny managing the valuable
time we all have. when you set goals and strive, it will likely
workout as plan.

what subjects did you study and where?
d***@dex.hmoob.net
2005-05-10 07:50:45 UTC
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Vanh has covered well...

But it is very much an egg or chicken debate: which one is more
importance - the system of governance vs. the "Bo phene Ngang"
mentality? The system of giovernance is all about Leadership...

As I always maintain that Laos is NOT poor... you just have to looka
arounf Vientiane... all the villa and cars on the street! But at the
same time, the students still lack toilet facilities!

So which is which?

Pao
ລາວນອກ
2005-05-10 11:07:14 UTC
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Very well articulated Ai Vahn. Enjoyed it as always.

Somxay
ກາສາລາວ
2005-05-10 12:51:20 UTC
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dear vanh,

if you have some free time please email me or dr. pao directly. we have
some serious bidness to discuss with you. if time permits i would like
you to join the newly formed FLSA(former lycee students association).
we are trying to get everybody on board, regardless of promotion, as
long as the person has set foot to the lycee ground before 1976.

--casalao
Padek
2005-05-10 13:39:07 UTC
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Well said Vanh. Bravo. You've covered just about everything. I think
Lao people are pretty adapted people,just look at Laonorks they've
adapted to the competive way of life of the western country to survive.
Many did very well and some become crazy because of the stress that
they got from competive life. Again, Blu eventhough China has progress
but it still has a lot of poor people and still has long way to go to
catch up with Japan.
Post by Vanh
Lao's underdevelopment tend to be often oversimplified by many even in
this forum or as a simple trend of laziness. Well if laziness is the
only cause, nothing should be of great concern, because laziness can be
just temporary exertion and curable by the right environment of social
competitiveness as for any individual once this one has to struggle for
his/her own survival, people become less lazy. Unfortunatly whoever is
drawing this kind of easy conclusion is undermining the whole complex
issues of Lao's geographical, historical, social, economical, and
internal conflicts problems, which have deeply impacted the human
behavior of the whole Lao society ever since the founding of the
country up to today.
Many informations could be found from a collection of resarch books
from the Westerners and Asians alike on this subject. However, I'm
simply glad to reintroduce a few of these basic characters often made
up of the misundestanding from which it seems to obstruct the human
core condition from the real development of Laos in the modern times.
First thing comes in mind, is Lao's vast under populated density which
has ever been threated by the struggle of survival from starvation or
famine. So the country has been blessed for generations of easy way of
life, as result, naturally developed with a sense of inrush and less to
compete for non-essential things, because the harsch human condition is
not required to do so like those overpopulated countries such as in
Vietnam or China where struggle is a way of life, and resist to work
could spell simply death.
Historically, the population has never been properly united under one
central governance's allegiance not until last century under the French
colonial times to form one rule to pledge for a resemblance of one
country status. This tends to delay the natural process of the sense of
statehood belonging, where many still believe they still pledge to
their own Bane and Muang, and the word Pathet is not the familiar term
used by many even today. Muang Lao rather than Pathet Lao is still
buried deeply in the psychological sense of belonging.
Social bonding is particularly strong based on the buddhist traditons
or animistic worship essentially around the the vicinity of buddhist
temples or village, or township level without any strong building block
of middle commerce or trading among people, but only basic bartering
at the local. This vacuum in competitive trading classes since
centuries has tended to create a society less competitive and short in
enterpreneurship which are the ingredients of any basic economy or
human developments into supplies and demands.
Internal conflicts have been one of the most devastating factor to
establish any durable legacy of governance on which people can
depend.
Post by Vanh
Up to now, the Lao government still with dictatorial stance has just
begun to learn the ABC of economy and governing basic skills. It's fair
to say that any government even priro to the communist regime has never
established any roll model from which Lao people can learn and take
pride, because in any country, people need a favorable environment
created by the government like in China actually especially for
encouraging and promulgating the law of free exchange in goods and
service of economy even with less degree of freedom people can
tolerate
Post by Vanh
or accept for the time being, but essentially at least it's a
guidance
Post by Vanh
of direction people need to orient themselves without fear of
reprisal.
Post by Vanh
Of course, in Lao DRP, we can't expect the same miracle like in China
at least yet, because unfortunaly we have been stuck in such dilemma of
two folds at once, government lacks of inspiration and people lacks of
skills. So these gravities pulls in different directions, any
foreseeable progress has to depend absolutely on the huge quantity of
graduates from a steady functional of education system from K1 to
College and beyond.Of course, 30 years have gone by could have formed
enough any of competent class to tackle the economy or else
problems...
Post by Vanh
Time has stuck again in another yet immobility of Lao habit with no
avail of any miracle. Nobody expects any easy answer, but at least
expect some established structure to pave the way of accommodation for
the future.
Up to now, how anyone can perceive any tangible progress since the
funding of schools is still way down just secondary to the funding of
the high ranking official's own villa or housing. The disparity doesn't
give any precise goal for education as the most vital priority for the
country.
Here we go, it's more than any simple laziness as anyone wants to
characterize for Lao's underdevelopment. It really needs a
revolutionary and fundamental face lift in doing things other than the
usual "Bo phene Ngang".
Vanh
Her Lao
2005-05-10 15:35:25 UTC
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"Vanh" <***@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:***@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com

    Lao's underdevelopment tend to be often oversimplified by many even
in
this forum or as a simple trend of laziness. Well if laziness is the
only cause, nothing should be of great concern, because laziness can be
just temporary exertion and curable by the right environment of social
competitiveness as for any individual once this one has to struggle for
his/her own survival, people become less lazy. Unfortunatly whoever is

*** "Bo phene Ngang" is NOT even a serious thing; indeed, the attitude
PERTAINS to mostly individual and inter-personal DISPLAY of
FORGIVENESS even when egregiously wronged by others; this, in
fact, is one of the most endearing features about HOMO SAPIENS,
that is, endearing that despite the chaos, the violence, the greed, the
deceit, the dog-eat-dog attitudes, beliefs, and practices of MUCH of
mankind ----- that this FORGIVING trait/nature/charateristic is still
VERY
MUCH a part of SOME people, is still "alive" in some people,,, It is,
THEREFORE, a "strength," NOT a weakness,,, in the larger scheme of
things,,,

*** To me, one who fancies himself as a keen observer of mankind,
I am very happy that people, groups of people, like the LAOTIANS
still have this FORGIVING nature being a truly and daily belief and
practice of theirs,,,, IN LAOS and perhaps in other places, too,
wherever
the Laotians or their descendants may find themselves to be.

*** "Bo phene ngang," therefore, again, IS NOT a negative or even a
hindering thing or "attitude" or trait to have and to perpetuate, that
is,
as a SOCIAL and/or interpersonal display (that is, this ability to
turn
the other cheek even in the face of destruction and deep pain; and
to smile and be civil as as one is spitted at, taunted, or abused by
brutes and the much more violent people),,,,,

*** What concerns me, as an insignificant whose start in life, whose
first breaths were nurtured by the winds, rains, storms, sun, moon,
rivers, mountains, cities, villages, and colorful people of LAOS ----
someone who has wandered off to the fringes of that land of
"Lang-Xang" for many life times now, it seems ---- what concerns
me THE MOST is the righteous attitude, the FALSE beliefs of those
who have made their way to the TOP of LAOS ruling structures,,,
who, though shit, eat, dream, swear, spit, have sex, sleep, cry, love
and hate JUST EXACTLY like all others HUMAN BEINGS (but
especially like their very affluent counter parts in the WEST, in the
developed world, who become rulers only in LIMITED time frames
and can not make too many PERMANENT or deep impact DECREES
and "laws", who did NOT make CONSTITUTIONAL CHANGES and
do it easily TO PROTECT themselves and their ideologies and
political parties [you, of course see so-called Conservatives and
their bible-thumbing friends LIKE to "re-take" America and TAKE
HERE BACK to a TIME in the past their thought glorious ---- before
the advent of LIBERALISM and Homosexuality/Lesbianism,
"multi-culturism," etc.],,,,,,,,,

,,,,,, what really concerns me is that these Laotian leaders, most of
who have LIMITED formal education (and even if their tutees have
more, people like Thanouxay and those in the 30's, 40's, and 50's
who are "moving up" the ladder of political imports),,,,, who have
very narrow view of the world, of BROAD and sound thoughts on
BROAD subjects like history, jurisprudence, political governance,
education, scientific inquiries, etc., etc. ------ THEY get to DECIDE
what's right, what's wrong, what's allowed, what's not allowed, what
THE PEOPLE want or do not want --------- what the PEOPLE are
allowed to THINK or not to think,,,, and they THEN make, through
the passage of AD HOC, quid pro quo laws,,,,, ENGENDER and
"nurture" such a pessimistc, negative, ISOLATED, arbitrary, and
constrained sets of beliefs, practices, and norms that, OVER TIME,
they breed mediocrity, foolishness, unsound thinking and planning,
"correct" ideologies, etc., etc. into the people --------- they not only
get
to "decide" those thoughts ,, BUT they also get to STAMP those
"correct" thoughts into a NATION'S CONSTITUTION and say that
"the People" have "SPOKEN" and that THAT'S what "the People"
want",,,,,,, "worries" me,,,, if any thing,,,,

*** This mentality of small-time leaders, with very NARROW and
LOCALIZED visions (but who DECREE that those visions of
theirs, those thoughts of theirs,,, they ARE really the broadest
and most sound, most efficacious thoughts),,, who are making
"laws" for LOCAL people, in "local ways",,,, BUT, who, INDREICTLY,
keep arguing if the LOCAL folks follow these "rules" and "laws"
made by these benevolent, democratic, and visionary leaders,,,
that THEY, the local folks, would CATCH-UP to or surpassing
OTHERS from around the world who and whose leaders GO BY
MORE BROADLY articulated "mandates", rules, laws, and such,,,,
THAT'S what "worries" me ----- because THAT ain't gonna happen;
in a COMPETITIVE WORLD, in a global economy, where
INFORMATION FLOW is not anchored on "correct"-ness and other
correct ideological nonsense but on the LAW OF EFFICACY,
transmitted more or less at the speed of light,,, LOCAL mentality,
stamped as "correct" and benevolent and democratic is not going
to make the local believers and practitioners more competitive, more
able, more efficient, EVEN IF THEIR LEADERS dictate that to
CONTRADICT the "correct" view, the official view, is "negative
phenomena" and "prohibitive by law", ad nauseam,,,

*** again,,, if any thing worries me about people and situations
like the Laotians, those we had parted from all these 30 plus years
----- THAT'S what worries me, NOT the "Bo Phene Ngang" trait,
which is an awesome trait to have, to nurture, to teach,,,


    Here we go, it's more than any simple laziness as anyone wants to
characterize for Lao's underdevelopment. It really needs a
revolutionary and fundamental face lift in doing things other than the
usual  "Bo phene Ngang".


Vanh
--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
ລາວໃຫຍ່
2005-05-15 11:44:01 UTC
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Sabaidee

I have been to many places in USA and Canada and talked to many
Lao,young and old.I found out that many have more than one job and some
are doing over time,more than 40 hours weekly.This means that you can
not say that our brothers and sisters in north America are lazy.

Lao people in the mother land just don't have ambitions and
competitiveness, that's all.
So whose job it is to encourage them to work hard for their family and
the country.I am sure it is not the responsibilty of private
sector's.If today's goverment can't do the job,they must step down and
let somebody else take the driver's seat.

Hakpheng
ລາວຄຳຫອມ
2005-05-10 03:39:12 UTC
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it's the mountains, the only reason.
2***@denmark.k12.wi.us
2017-04-26 22:04:17 UTC
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Post by blublu
Being Chinese students studying Lao language, we are always wondering
why this beautiful country is so poor, undeveleped--------maybe one
the 10 poorest countries in the World--released by the World Bank.
Parts of our students find one element, that is, the culture of Laos,
which regards being happy as the most important thing in their own
life, rather than the material progress, like the Chiness. That is why
almost all Chinese travelling or working in Laos have the strange
feeling that the Lao people are always "Lazy" .
But I think "LAZY" is not a stable word.
My dear friends, what's your opinion towards this element despite many
other reasons whatever historcial or geographical?
ຜີ
2017-05-10 15:55:25 UTC
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I was reading an article in Fortune the other day about Estonia, a tiny country by the Baltic sea. Couple decades ago after Soviet collapsed this country was dirt poor. Now Estonians, 1.3 millions of them, are among the richest people in EU. Adopting, adapting, educating their populations to digital world/markets allowed them to jump to the forefront of world economy. They are on par with japan and Singapore in term of education and economy. That is just a short of 30 years. The question is, why can't Laos do this. We have small population and should be able to mobilize this quickly. Force every student, from kindergarden, to learn computer programming and digital media. Make wireless access to internet free in the country. Convert every process in government into digital. Imagine, 20 years from now we have a country as rich and digital savvy as Estonia?
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